Playoff Double Elim
- Charlie Brennan
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9 ปี 4 เดือน ที่ผ่านมา #853
โดย Charlie Brennan
Playoff Double Elim was created by Charlie Brennan
Could we make the playoffs double elimination and give every team at least two playoff matches?
Also a certain Mr William Watson (who may or may not be in possession of a suspect number of balls) passionately extolled to me last night the idea of the last 16 playoff being a draw, rather than a straight 16 vs 1, 15 vs 2 etc.
The effect of this could be to make the regular Wednesday match less important pointswise, you just need to get into the top 16. Whatever other good and bad luck it throws up it would almost always make the top four teams progress more difficult as right now the #1 team have the statistically easiest route of anyone, and they're the people that need it least.
The best team should still win, and anyone going out would do so because they were beaten.
Could we combine these ideas? Random draw with double elim?
Also a certain Mr William Watson (who may or may not be in possession of a suspect number of balls) passionately extolled to me last night the idea of the last 16 playoff being a draw, rather than a straight 16 vs 1, 15 vs 2 etc.
The effect of this could be to make the regular Wednesday match less important pointswise, you just need to get into the top 16. Whatever other good and bad luck it throws up it would almost always make the top four teams progress more difficult as right now the #1 team have the statistically easiest route of anyone, and they're the people that need it least.
The best team should still win, and anyone going out would do so because they were beaten.
Could we combine these ideas? Random draw with double elim?
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- Bernard Condrau
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9 ปี 4 เดือน ที่ผ่านมา #854
โดย Bernard Condrau
Replied by Bernard Condrau on topic Re:Playoff Double Elim
Just be reminded that double elimination would extend the playoffs from current 16 matches in 4 rounds to 30 matches in 8 rounds, hence adding another 2 weeks to the season, unless we would play more than 2 rounds within one week, or shorten the regular season to 18 weeks.
I do not like the idea of random pairing, but double elimination playoffs could be a way to give weaker teams the chance to progress further.
Elaborating more on this idea, the upper 16 teams could play double elimination playoffs within 4 weeks, while the lower bracket teams could play single elimination playoffs, but on Wednesdays only, extending the single elimination playoffs to 4 weeks, too. There might be less reason for those teams to forfeit the first round of the playoffs.
I do not like the idea of random pairing, but double elimination playoffs could be a way to give weaker teams the chance to progress further.
Elaborating more on this idea, the upper 16 teams could play double elimination playoffs within 4 weeks, while the lower bracket teams could play single elimination playoffs, but on Wednesdays only, extending the single elimination playoffs to 4 weeks, too. There might be less reason for those teams to forfeit the first round of the playoffs.
กรุณา เข้าสู่ระบบ เพื่อเข้าร่วมวงสนทนา
- Charlie Brennan
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9 ปี 4 เดือน ที่ผ่านมา #855
โดย Charlie Brennan
Replied by Charlie Brennan on topic Re:Playoff Double Elim
Good point Bernard that could be another very positive effect.
Are you sure about the numbers there? Yes there would be double the number of matches to play but also there would be double the number of games happening at least on day 2 because no one would have been eliminated.
Day 1 - 8 matchesDay 2 - 8 matchesDay 3 - ? matches (potentially 8!)Day 4 - up to 4 matchesDay 5 - up to 3 matchesDay 6 - 1 matchPossible Day 7 - 1 matchhaha I'm totally not sure about how this would work, it's complicated and my brain hurts! What would be the maximum amount of days to reach a result? What's the minimum? Is it possible we'd end up with less overall matches?
Are you sure about the numbers there? Yes there would be double the number of matches to play but also there would be double the number of games happening at least on day 2 because no one would have been eliminated.
Day 1 - 8 matchesDay 2 - 8 matchesDay 3 - ? matches (potentially 8!)Day 4 - up to 4 matchesDay 5 - up to 3 matchesDay 6 - 1 matchPossible Day 7 - 1 matchhaha I'm totally not sure about how this would work, it's complicated and my brain hurts! What would be the maximum amount of days to reach a result? What's the minimum? Is it possible we'd end up with less overall matches?
กรุณา เข้าสู่ระบบ เพื่อเข้าร่วมวงสนทนา
- Bernard Condrau
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9 ปี 4 เดือน ที่ผ่านมา #856
โดย Bernard Condrau
Replied by Bernard Condrau on topic Re:Playoff Double Elim
Here are the rounds for double elimination playoffs, order reflects the match days (e.g. "1." = Day 1):
A few more things to consider:
- 8 matches, winner bracket
- 8 matches total, 4 winner bracket, 4 loser bracket
- 4 matches, loser bracket
- 4 matches total, 2 winner bracket, 2 loser bracket
- 2 matches, loser bracket
- 2 matches total, 1 winner bracket, 1 loser bracket (loser of this match is 4th place)
- 1 match, loser bracket (loser of this match is 3rd place)
- 1 match between winners of the winner bracket and the loser bracket
- should the winner of the loser bracket win, then one more match needs to be played, on the same day following the first match, or within 3 days scheduled by the two teams
A few more things to consider:
- With single elimination, 8 teams are knocked out in day 1 and remain without match for 1.5 weeks until the finals.
- With double elimination, 4 teams are knocked out in day 2 and remain without match for 3 weeks until the finals. Another 4 teams are knocked out in day 3 and remain without match for 2.5 weeks until the finals.
- Teams in the winner bracket play the first Sunday and then Wednesdays only including the finals.
- Double elimination would not need to have the not-so-much-liked match for 3rd place.
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- Dominic Johnson
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9 ปี 4 เดือน ที่ผ่านมา - 9 ปี 4 เดือน ที่ผ่านมา #860
โดย Dominic Johnson
Replied by Dominic Johnson on topic Re:Playoff Double Elim
There is an alternative solution to allow some teams a second chance. We could follow the Australian play-off system. They have a system where by the worst losers in the first round are eliminated but the best losers are rewarded with a second chance vs a narrow winner while the big winners are able to skip a round and progress straight to a quarter final.It's all explained in the
McIntyre Final Eight System
and the
AFL Finals System
.
Last edit: 9 ปี 4 เดือน ที่ผ่านมา by Bernard Condrau.
กรุณา เข้าสู่ระบบ เพื่อเข้าร่วมวงสนทนา
- Charlie Brennan
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9 ปี 4 เดือน ที่ผ่านมา #862
โดย Charlie Brennan
Replied by Charlie Brennan on topic Re:Playoff Double Elim
Are you saying Dominic that we should change the play offs to more-than-2 strands of groups-of-8 teams?
That could be cool... It's hardly surprising that some teams appear to feel strongly that they don't want to finish 16th :-P and there's no law saying it has to be two brackets...
More games, more semis & more finals, 6 out of 8 teams play a minimum of 2 matches, every team would be in a bracket they have a realistic chance of winning. Champions of top bracket still righteous overall champs. I like this that you suggested Dom; AFL Finals System , check it out peeps, it could be a lot of fun. No second lives if you lose the final.
Happy New Year everyone
That could be cool... It's hardly surprising that some teams appear to feel strongly that they don't want to finish 16th :-P and there's no law saying it has to be two brackets...
More games, more semis & more finals, 6 out of 8 teams play a minimum of 2 matches, every team would be in a bracket they have a realistic chance of winning. Champions of top bracket still righteous overall champs. I like this that you suggested Dom; AFL Finals System , check it out peeps, it could be a lot of fun. No second lives if you lose the final.
Happy New Year everyone
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ผู้ดูแล: Lenny Erickson, Dominic Johnson
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