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Path:HomeForumLeague ForumRules • Simultaneous Hit Clarification

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Simultaneous Hit Clarification

Mehr
8 Jahre 1 Woche her #982 von Jeff Trageser
Is a simultaneous hit, where the initial contact by thecue ball hits two balls from two different color groups at the same time, a foul or a good hit? The rules only state that the cue ball must hit the shooter's color group first and does not mention a simultaneous hit situation. In a simultaneous hit, the shooter's color group is not contacted first, since two colors are hit at the same time.
Thank you for your consideration,
Jeff TrageserScandal Team Captain



Hello Everybody,



I need a rule clarification for an issue that came up in our
match last night. I was the referee and our player was down to one colored ball
and the other player was on the eight ball. The two balls were situated
very close to each other but were not touching. Our player shot and made his
ball. Both balls were hit by the cue ball, but the hit was too close to
call which ball was hit first and I called it a simultaneous hit and gave the
next shot to our player (who made the eight ball on the next shot). The
player on the other team felt that the cue ballhit the eight ball first
and our player insisted that hehithis colored ball first.



Regarding the shot and call in question,the player on the
other teamsaid that since I calleda simultaneous hit, that the shot
was a foul, since the rules state that you must hit your colored ball first and
hitting both balls at the same time is not hitting your colored ball
first. I thought there was some clarification in the rules regarding a simultaneous
hit. I read through the rules twice and I could not find anything
clarifying the case were the cue ball hits two different colored balls
simultaneously in the initial hit. The rules only state that the cue ball
must hit your colored ball first.



After reading the rules, I kind of agree with the player on the
other team, and that a called simultaneous hit should be a foul. In my
case I should have called it too close to call and give the benefit of the
doubt to the shooter or just called it a good hit, our player hit his ball
first.



Please provide feedback on how this situation should be handled
and whether a simultaneous hit is a good hit or a foul. If it is a good
hit, then I think we should put some clarification in the rules.



Thank you for your consideration.



Warm regards,



Jeff Trageser

Scandal Team Captain

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Mehr
8 Jahre 1 Woche her #984 von Bernard Condrau
A shot, which hits 2 balls of different colors at the same time, or when it cannot be positively determined that the wrong ball was hit first, is a valid shot (e.g. a good hit). Refer to rule 4.2. Wrong Ball First which requires hitting the wrong ball before hitting a ball of the shooter's group to be a foul.


Good decisions come from experience. Experience comes from making bad decisions. [Samuel Langhorne Clemens]

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Mehr
8 Jahre 1 Woche her #985 von Jeff Trageser
Hi Bernard,
3.9 Standard Fouls states "4.2 Wrong Ball First; the first ball contacted by the cue ball on each shot must belong to the shooter's group, except when the table is open."
I suggest maybe we should put some clarification for when both balls are hit simultaneously. Or change the wording in 3.9 to coincide with the wording in 4.2.
The 4.2 definition of the foul is when the wrong ball is hit first, and 3.9 says the shooter's ball must be contacted first.
Thank you for your support.
Jeff


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Mehr
8 Jahre 1 Woche her #987 von Bernard Condrau
I agree, we should add a clarification to the rule. The wording of the rules should not be changed though, as they are taken from, and are identical with, the WPA and BCA rules (Paragraph numbering is different, and some details in wording, as WPA and BCA regulate all pocket pool games, such as eight ball, nine ball, ten ball, etc).

Note that the cue ball very rarely hit both balls at the exact time, however, determining the sequence of hits accurately is difficult in some situations. Often, the sequence of hits can only be determined by understanding the physics of where the different balls go after the hit, read the following article for some examples: Which ball did you hit first?

Although it is not stated anywhere in the rules, fouls should be called only if they can be positively determined.


Good decisions come from experience. Experience comes from making bad decisions. [Samuel Langhorne Clemens]

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